This is the companion discussion topic for this article.
With the Flareon/Empoleon build how are you getting the Empoleon in play? Ditto can only have a basic and you do not have any of two cards that lead up to Empoleon in the deck what am I missing?
I figured it out it is the archies
Any advice for the groudon mirror?
I think Exeggutor and Leafeon are there to handle that. Although I am a bit skeptical about Exeggutor. It’s a clever tech, and makes the deck really spicy , but its problem is that a measly 10 damage per Blockade is next to nothing. However, if you get it out early, I guess it would really slow down the Primal Groudon. Clever tech!
I’m kind of conflicted with something. Which is better in Flareon; 2 Jirachi EX, 0 Deoxys EX, or 1 Jirachi EX, 1 Deoxys EX, or 2 Jirachi EX, 1 Deoxys EX?
OldSchool420- Groudon mirror can be tricky, especially when there are so many different builds. I’ve seen them built for speed with heavy landorus and discard counts, the slow and efficient robo substitute style, and then this style i’ve posted with the masquerian which I believe is the best of both worlds. I would say the key to the groundon matchup is forcing your opponent to bring up the first Groudon. If you can bring up a Primal Groudon with a Focus Sash and then time out a Scramble Switch to perfection, the game should be over.
Smashandslash- Yeah the Exeggutor is a wall to continue your setup while they struggle to get anything going. However, if you can find a Silver Bangle early then 80 Damage to Groudon and Seismitoad become a major threat. To answer your other question, I think 1 Jirachi and 1 Deoxys is fine. If anything, a 2/2 Archie/Empoleon to help guarantee Empoleon hits the board as soon as possible would be a nice change. If Empoleon is on board, you won’t need help from Jirachi.
Hey Kyle, enjoyed the read. Is there any way to fit in a 4th Crushing Hammer in your Slurpuff/Toad list? Also: How is it’s matchup vs Fairy?
The 2nd Enhanced could easily become a 4th Crushing, it all depends on your meta.
As for the Fairy matchup, I think its quite favorable. The Dragalge is especially helpful against a deck so use to free retreat with Fairy Garden
The second Enhanced is useful, but I still feel lacking and that I have to Trump Card often so I can keep Hammers going.
What do you think the play would be in a metagame where you’re expecting Flareon, Yveltal/Garb, and Fairybox (rainbow energy varient)? I have been testing Seismitoad/Slurpuff and it’s been testing pretty well:
4 VS Seeker
1 Lysandre’s Trump Card
4 Professor Juniper
3 Super Scoop Up
4 Crushing Hammer
2 Head Ringer
4 Ultra Ball
1 Scoop Up Cyclone
2 Float Stone
4 Hypnotoxic Laser
2 Virbank City Gym
3 Muscle Band
Against Flareon, I don’t attach a DCE T1 because of Leafeon, but then from there I make sure to keep only 1 DCE on the field at a time and it’s an easy matchup, especially with Trump Card shutting down their only other out. The big issue with this matchup is when they drop a bangle before I Quaking Punch, then it can can turn a 3HKO from Leafeon into a 2HKO, but even then Xerosic helps against that.
Against Fairybox I just figured that hammering away their Rainbows would take care of the matchup really well, Xerosic also helps to get rid of them. Head Ringer really helps here
Against Yveltal/Garbodor, I learned that you need to hammer away their energies at any chance you get, especially their DCEs. Head Ringer helps to shut down Yveltals and opposing Toads, and Xerosic gets rid of DCEs and whatever tool is on Garbodor.
So I was thinking of what changes I should make, and these are some of the few that have came to mind:
- More Xerosic? It seems really good in any matchup, but I’d rather focus on adding more consistency
- Acro Bike? Helps you get the T1 Quaking Punch more often, and discarding isn’t that big of an issue because the deck focuses heavily on trump card.
- Bike? People have been telling me to take Bikes out of the list, but in testing they have been extremely crucial in helping me set up as well as get the T1 Quaking Punch.
What are your thoughts, Kyle?
Yet another question haha, how is the Landorus Bats matchup with Primal Groudon?
driscollblood - Seismitoad/Slurpuff could be a great play in a metagame like this. I like Xerosic, but 1 should be plenty. I prefer Acro Bike to Bicycle in this deck, as hand size rarely dips below 4 after the first turn. You seem to have a solid strategy coming into all of these matchups, I wish you the best!
OshaWaterBottle - No worries haha, If you are the Landorus/Bats player, it’s important to throw damage at bench Groudons as much as possible and use Crobat as an attacker (fighting resistance is quite helpful). If you don’t bench ex’s, you will have a much longer match, but it will be progressively more favorable as it goes on.
The match as a whole is hard to judge as players play it quite differently. All I can really say is what i’ve learned from my perspective as the bat player.